Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: Maybe found a diamond in the rough?

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    7

    Maybe found a diamond in the rough?

    I was at a gun show in Alberta when I as coincidence would have it I bought my first pre WW2 German rifle (a Ernst Friedrich Büchel falling block .22)
    and I stumbled upon another one.
    I bought this because it was interesting and the price was right (I actually have no idea what this is worth so maybe I got taken, no idea. But it was cool, I wanted it and so I bought it)

    The fine gentlemen selling it told me it was a 98 in 8mm.
    At the base of the barrel under the stock it reads "7,8mm" with 2 symbols above it. nothing else on the barrel, the receiver at the base of the stock shows the same symbols.

    It says "Simpson & Co Suhl Waffenfabrken" on top of the barrel, Im guessing thats "Simpson and & co made in Sulh"

    On the receiver it reads "2,75 gG RR
    S.G."
    Under the action is a random "R" then below it W C
    2. 7
    The number "27" is stamped on the bolt safety.

    If you know anything about it please let me know, I would like to restore it if it wouldn't hurt the value to much.

  2. #2
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    7
    More pictures

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    913
    The rifle was most likely built by the Simson & Co. factory in Suhl about 1912, on a Commercial Mauser, Oberndorf, action. Proofed in Suhl with the special proof using the "4000 at" proof powder, shown by the CROWN - crown/N proofmarks. It is certainly in 8x57I, .318" bullets. 2.75 gramm = 42 gr Gewehr Blättchen Pulver = rifle flake powder and a SG = Stahlmantel Geschoss = steel jacketed bullet was the service load it was proofed for. As the bore/land Diameter is aleady given in post-1912 millimeters, but the service load still in the pre-1912 form, it is safe to assume 1912 being the date.
    BTW, the Name of the Suhl gunmaker was Simson. Mr.Simpson is an American gun dealer who imports many old guns from Europe.

  4. #4
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    7
    I was told because of the clip slot this action is at least as old ass WW1?
    Again I know nothing of mausers
    Attached Images Attached Images

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    913
    BS! All original Oberndorf Mausers commercial actions up to 1945 had clip slots, even the square bridge actions and the late 1930s ones without thumbholes. So clipslots are unusable for dating. I already dated the rifle to 1912, based on the proofmarks.

  6. #6
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    7
    Sounds good to me,
    Again, thank you very much

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    913
    As you confessed to know little about Mauser rifles: Your "new" Simson made rifle is a fine example of the typical pre-WW1 Suhl sporter style, built as a sporter by rhe renowned Simson company. Half –octagonal, ribbed barrel, flat bolt handle. Sporter stock with round, uncapped pistol grip, Schnabel foreend tip and oval panels in the action area. Plus the rifle seems to be still in original condition, just as it left the Simson factory more than 100 years ago. Most examples you encounter nowadays were heavily altered, often quite recently. Action drilled and tapped for modern American scope mounts or receiver sights, new slanted bolt handle welded on, stock fitted with a white-line ventilated recoil pad and so on. The original condition makes your rifle a real collector's item. A few drops of linseed oil and some tlc , careful cleaning, is all you should do to the rifle. You have not found "a diamond in the rough", but a real gem with some tarnishing on it.
    I have not the slightest doubt that the rifle is safe to use, provided the bore is not rusted out completely. In your place, I would not search the international market for some custom loaded 8x57I, .318" bullet, loads in the first place. The emasculated American "8 mm Mauser" loads by Remington and Winchester are designed to be safe in such rifles too. They are loaded with slightly undersize 170 gr .321" bullets to very low pressures. When you have a few empty cases, fireformed in your rifle, take an 8 mm S .323" bullet. If this slips free in and out the unresized case, you may use European full power 8x57IS loads too.
    Last edited by Axel E; 01-20-2016 at 10:20 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •